The 4 Freedoms Library

It takes a nation to protect the nation

Where's the Italian version of the EDL when you need them?

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Saturday, 28 May 2011 10:17

Italy's largest Muslim group has sent a message to Italy's highest ranking bishop to thank him for his organisation's support for a project to construct a mosque in Milan, the country's conservative business hub.



The issue of an official mosque is a politically charged one in Milan which has been a conservative stronghold for almost two decades. Milan's mayor Letizia Moratti, a former national education minister from the ruling People of Freedom Party says she opposes the construction of the mosque requested by the city's mostly migrant Muslim community.

A mosque in Italy's financial capital would "create a centre of attraction for Islamic groups from all over Italy who then would not be controllable," Moratti said.

Italian Prime Minister Silvio Berlusconi has also voiced his strong opposition to the construction of a mosque in Milan and gave his support to Milan's mayor.

"Milan ... cannot become, at the eve of the Expo 2015, an Islamic city, a city of gypsies, full of Roma camps and besieged by foreigners to whom (the left) wants to give voting rights," Berlusconi said.

However, Angelo Bagnasco, who leads Italy's Bishops' Conference (CEI), has given his support to Milan's Muslims.

In a message to Bagnasco, Muslim community said: "We are relieved and immensely grateful for the position voiced by senior officials from the Italian Bishops' Conference in support of official places of worship for Muslims, an issue which nowadays has wrongly become a political hot potato."

"The brotherly solidarity of the great majority of Christians, which we have experienced at thousands of inter-faith gatherings and debates, has been strongly confirmed," the statement added.

Speaking to journalists on Tuesday during the CEI's general assembly at the Vatican, CEI secretary-general Mariano Crociata confirmed that the Catholic Church backed "the right to freedom of worship and places of worship to exercise this fundamental right".

"We must take account of the social needs of our communities as Italy's constitution requires," Crociata said.

Muslims were due on Wednesday to rally in Milan's central Piazza San Babila in support of the opposition centre-left's candidate for mayor Giuliano Pisapia who has voiced support for the building of a Milan mosque.

Pisapia will this weekend stand against conservative incumbent Letizia Moratti in an electoral run-off. In the first round of voting last week in which no candidate gained an outright majority of votes, Pisapia bested Moratti, taking some 48 percent of votes compared to her 42 percent.

Pisapia has criticised Moratti's position saying Milan should allow a proper place of worship for its Muslim community, which has been forced to hold prayers in makeshift venues such as garages and a disused cycle stadium. 

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Risposte a questa discussione

We must take account of the social needs of our communities as Italy's constitution requires," Crociata said.

Thats just the start of the lawfare. They,ll us the law to get their mosque, then they,ll just expand, as they do in most places. And all with the help of the second class christian church that they so dispise. 

With such weak leaders within the church its no wonder muslims feel able to make more and more demands.

Untill one of our European countries becomes an Islamic state no one is going to believe it can happen. Lets just hope its not to late for us when it does happen.

Generosity combined with ignorance is a suicidal combination.

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Mission Overview

Most Western societies are based on Secular Democracy, which itself is based on the concept that the open marketplace of ideas leads to the optimum government. Whilst that model has been very successful, it has defects. The 4 Freedoms address 4 of the principal vulnerabilities, and gives corrections to them. 

At the moment, one of the main actors exploiting these defects, is Islam, so this site pays particular attention to that threat.

Islam, operating at the micro and macro levels, is unstoppable by individuals, hence: "It takes a nation to protect the nation". There is not enough time to fight all its attacks, nor to read them nor even to record them. So the members of 4F try to curate a representative subset of these events.

We need to capture this information before it is removed.  The site already contains sufficient information to cover most issues, but our members add further updates when possible.

We hope that free nations will wake up to stop the threat, and force the separation of (Islamic) Church and State. This will also allow moderate Muslims to escape from their totalitarian political system.

The 4 Freedoms

These 4 freedoms are designed to close 4 vulnerabilities in Secular Democracy, by making them SP or Self-Protecting (see Hobbes's first law of nature). But Democracy also requires - in addition to the standard divisions of Executive, Legislature & Judiciary - a fourth body, Protector of the Open Society (POS), to monitor all its vulnerabilities (see also Popper). 
1. SP Freedom of Speech
Any speech is allowed - except that advocating the end of these freedoms
2. SP Freedom of Election
Any party is allowed - except one advocating the end of these freedoms
3. SP Freedom from Voter Importation
Immigration is allowed - except where that changes the political demography (this is electoral fraud)
4. SP Freedom from Debt
The Central Bank is allowed to create debt - except where that debt burden can pass across a generation (25 years).

An additional Freedom from Religion is deducible if the law is applied equally to everyone:

  • Religious and cultural activities are exempt from legal oversight except where they intrude into the public sphere (Res Publica)"

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