The 4 Freedoms Library

It takes a nation to protect the nation

LibDems labelling HJS as "far right". Douglas Murray was ostracised from the Tory party. Anyone who criticises islam is regarded as "far right".  Even Student Rights is now being cast in that vein.

Looks like Douglas Murray needn't have bothered trying to keep clear water between him and EDL.

Presumably Harry's Place and One Law For All are going to be designated as "far right" too.  Peter Tatchll better keep his head down, or he too will find himself lumped alongside Enoch Powell, Hitler, Genghis Khan and Tamerlaine.  Oh, hang on, the latter could never be "far right" no matter how many people he killed, because he was a muslim.

Since WW2, which world leader proudly declared himself a fascist?  The muslim leader Mawdudi.  But he can't be a fascist because, by defintion, only those opposed to islam can be considered fascist.


http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2013/06/06/mps-deserting-student-ri...

Politicians are deserting counter-extremism group Student Rights, the Huffington Post UK can exclusively reveal, following the group's controversial campus extremism report, as well as links with a far-right society.

One MP has already resigned as an advisor for the organisation, whose recent study was criticised by student leaders as a "witch hunt", while another is considering following suit.

Tom Brake, Liberal Democrat MP, has left the Student Rights' board, shortly after resigning from the Henry Jackson Society think tank. The Carshalton and Wallington MP threw the towel in following comments from the HJS' senior executive Douglas Murray.

mps desert student rights

Tom Brake, left, has resigned, while Jim Fitzpatrick is considering removing himself from the board

 

Earlier this year, Murray complained London had become a "foreign country", while in 2006, he said conditions for Muslims should be made "harder".

In an email, Brake told HuffPost UK blogger Hilary Aked: "I am no longer listed on their website and I have also asked for my name to be removed from the Student Rights advisory board."

Brake has already been replaced by Ghaffar Hussain, director of training at the Quilliam Foundation, another group which "challenges extremism".

Labour MP Jim Fitzpatrick is also looking to distance himself from the group.

Aked emailed Fitzpatrick voicing her concerns about Student Rights' "poor research methods and muddling the debate about extremism with the issue of segregation on campuses".

Fitzpatrick, MP for Poplar and Limehouse, replied saying he had requested his name be removed from Student Rights' advisory board "in light of these developments" and the group's "recent conduct".

However Fitzpatrick has since told HuffPost UK he has asked to be removed from the board but "decided to seek a meet with them first to clarify some recent issues before doing so completely".

The MP declined to disclose which issues he would be discussing.

Aked, a student at Bath University, said: "It's a positive sign that two MPs have decided to disassociate themselves from Student Rights, a non-transparent pressure group with no legitimacy among actual students and a track record of producing shoddy research.

"As a project of the Henry Jackson Society whose political support is also hemorrhaging because of Douglas Murray's Islamophobic statements, this further dents its credibility and hopefully it will reduce the platform the mainstream media gives it to spread its toxic narrative which only serves to whip up fear and mistrust."

LibDem Councillor Lord Monroe Palmer said he would not be resigning immediately but as a result of the study he would "monitor" his position as advisor as well as future Student Rights reports.

Student Rights' campus extremism study, which was published in May, was heavily criticised by student communities - both Muslim and non-Muslim. Mohamed Harrath, a student union executive at the London School of Economics, said the group was trying to "ramp up" the effects of Islamophobia on Muslim students.

"There is only one voice that is speaking about extremism on campus and it [Student Rights] completely distorts everything", he said at the time. "Other voices must be heard."

Pete Mercer, vice-president welfare officer for the National Union of Students dubbed the report a "witch hunt".

“We would welcome an open and balanced discussion about gender issues and religion but it’s important that contributions aren’t hysterical and that the word ‘extremism’ isn’t thrown around without justification," he said. "A witch hunt which makes sweeping judgments about student Islamic societies without knowing the details denies the women involved the very equality it claims to wish for them."

Following the backlash over its report, Student Rights released a statement blaming newspapers for "inaccurate" headlines which read: "At no point did we try to claim that our figures were representative of all student events, and those... who have an issue with inaccurate headlines should remember that for many media outlets the temptation to round up to the nearest exaggeration is often difficult to resist."

Other political figures on the advisory board include Robert Halfon, a Conservative MP, and Rt Hon Dr Kim Howells, a former Labour MP and minister of state.

Student Rights has yet to comment on the recent events.

Views: 3191

Replies to This Discussion

 

Islam has been declared a victim of anything and everything.  No debate can take place no report can be accepted if it critizises Islam. Thats why i have no confidence in this govenments 'new policies' to tackle extremism, because the only group it will identify as extreme, are those that critizise Islam, and that has cross party support. So who you gonna vote for. And lets remember Ukip doesn't want anyone who supports EDL.

I can see Monster Raving Looney Party making a come back.  I think Douglas Murry should think of standing for them. I think he would get in. They are probably the sanest party in Britain.

Plenty of talk about Islamophobia, but nothing about Kaffirophobia.

Plenty of talk about suppressing anti-Muslim hate speech, but none about Muslim hate speech.

It seems that you are not allowed to hate the people that hate you.  But the people that hate you can call you a pig, an ape, dumb cattle, deficient in intelligence and dirty, and that's fine.  The minute you take exception to that, expect the full force of the law and the media to come down on you.

The Master Race have got their special rights and privileges sewn up very nicely.

Those people who hate us are not just calling us animals.

They say gays are to be executed, israel is to be destroyed, buddhists, hindus, animists, atheists are to be turned into slaves, apostates are to be killed.

On the neo-nazi salute sweeping Europe's muslims (and defended by neo-nazis and the fascist Left).

"its frightening,its like a secret movement what on earth does the future hold,its like lines are being drawn"

https://twitter.com/lutonexcelsior/status/417266863509618688

People are starting to grasp the Chasm as it gets wider.

This is a documentary about the growth of US SOCOM special forces operations around the world.  The narrator is a bleeding heart liberal, but it has some useful info in it.
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt2532528/?ref_=fn_al_tt_1

I will try explain why I am putting it in this Chasm forum.

It appears that the US has vastly increased its use of Special Ops forces and is now using them worldwide for  targeted   assassinations.  It started with the small 9/11 hit list, then there was the Iraqi "deck of cards", but now the list seems to be far larger and growing.   Recognize this: these operations have grown and been further funded by Obama!

I see these ops as the result of a refusal to face up to key issues in two other areas:

  1. Democracies need to accept that wars are dirty, and need to relieve the conventional forces of constant oversight by the media and so on.  Its simply not possible to run a campaign against a ruthless and dirty enemy, with all your actions in the full glare of publicity.  This is a problem that oligarchies like China and Russia don't face.
  2. Democracies need to accept that the "open marketplace of ideas with zero oversight" model does not work.  You have to judge some of those ideas, specifically, those ideologies that use a gang based model to destroy the very fabric of democracy.  In this case, leaving aside the 'small' problem that Islam is mostly a political system, not a religion, Democracies need to engage in a 'war of ideas' with Islam over those parts of its manifesto that specify an intention to subvert democracy itself.

The above two steps are rubicons that democratic leaders are incapable of crossing.  So what do they do?  They resort to a 3rd model, an organisation funded and under the command of the president himself, not available to FOI requests, performing killings of sometimes US citizens, in over 75 countries worldwide.  And the icon of the Leftist Luvvies, Obama himself, is the greatest performer of this!

Wouldn't it be better to face issues (1) and (2) above, instead?  

But that would mean, facing the Chasm, acknowledging that it exists, and dealing with it realistically.  They can't accept these facts openly themselves, so instead they acknowledge it in a work-around, secretly.  They can't accept that the problem with Islam is an ideological one, and so must be fought on an ideological basis, with the creed of Islam examined under a judicial framework, and its treasonous components outlawed.  Nor can they accept that when US conventional forces confront an Islamic terror campaign in a Muslim country, that that war has to have some unpleasant sides to it, and the troops fighting it cannot do that effectively when they are constantly being watched and critiqued by bespectacled political activists, sitting in comfy chairs in air conditioned offices in safe US cities.

So instead, they create their own  guerrilla force.  Ironic, isn't it?

I agree that too is a sign of The Chasm.  So is this:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/law-and-order/10562363/Life-...

If any of us took up weapons-training because we (like 49% of the UK population) believe that civil war is coming, then we could be sentenced to life imprisonment because of that.  The government is making it illegal for civilians to learn to protect themselves, even when 49% think civil war is inevitable.

I can't remember if we've discussed this already, but keeping the entire population under surveillance is a sign of The Chasm. As is the TSA in the US doing body searches of 70yo wheelchair-bound nuns.

Here's another manifestation of The Chasm.

For 40 years in Britain the threat of "far right" Fascism and National Socialism have been used to scare the population (even when, post WW2, those who supported Fascism and National Socialism could never have been more than 5% of the population in Britain).  Then in the last 10 years or so, we've been told of the (supposed) threat of Fascism and National Socialism in Europe -- in the form of Le Pen, Jorg Haider, Pim Fortuyn, Oskar Freysinger, Geert Wilders, etc.

Now that these "fascist" parties in Europe are #1 in the polls in several countries in Europe, we hear nothing about this "threat".  Probably because it is now thought by the elite that if this knowledge gets out, it would lend more support to UKIP in Britain.

http://gatesofvienna.net/2014/01/the-euro-skeptic-surge/

Stupid Leftists attempt to attack a story in The Times, by denying that children born to muslims are muslims.  This type of disavowal is what they are reduced to, because the Left fail to acknowledge the impossibility (even in "liberal" countries like Britain) of a muslim leaving islam.

http://www.leftfootforward.org/2014/01/what-exactly-is-a-muslim-baby/

These Leftists are either a) totally ignorant of the situation of those born into muslim familes (which means these Leftists have to ignore FGM, muslim homophobia, "honour" killing, circumcision, or b) they are engaging in double-think.

http://www.theboltonnews.co.uk/news/10929928._Bolton_is_better_than...

"Bolton is a better place to live than London" says (London MP) Iain Duncan Smith.

As the chart below shows, not 1 person who actually lives in Bolton agrees with him.

Is there any clearer evidence a) that our politicians cannot open their mouths without hypocrisy and deceit, b) that their lies are the exact opposite of what ordinary people think?

The Huffington Post has got to be the finest example of Leftist delusion.

This Leftist rag started with all these unpaid wanna-be Leftist journalists writing for it.  Once it had built itself up as this paragon of Leftist "new media", it was sold off by the capitalist/Leftist owner, shafting all those unpaid writers who had made it what it was.

It is the singular, most-deluded "news site" I have come across.

They voted Mohammed the world's best example of a champion of Human Rights.

http://weaselzippers.us/too-funny-huffpo-calls-mohammed-a-universal-champion-of-human-rights/

Y
ep, the Mohammed who beheaded little boys, and sold their sisters and mothers off as slaves to be raped.

Narrated Atiyyah al-Qurazi: I was among the captives of Banu Qurayza. They (the Companions) examined us, and those who had begun to grow hair (pubes) were killed, and those who had not were not killed. I was among those who had not grown hair.Sunan Abu Dawood38:4390

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Invasion_of_Banu_Qurayza#Hadith_litera...

Joe: 'Stupid Leftists attempt to attack a story in The Times, by denying that children born to muslims are muslims...'

this reminds me of a comment I made sometime ago:

'At the same time Muslim children are required to be placed with Muslim parents, which in one instance resulted in a child being placed with Muslim terrorist Addulla Ahmed Ali, one of the Muslims convicted (Sept 2009) of plotting to blow up transatlantic jets. 

'This from Haringey council: 'Muslim children can only be placed with people of the same faith...' 

'The child was removed as soon as the police got involved, but 'The placement [] was made after checks and before anyone was made aware of any terroist activity in the extended family network.'

http://4freedoms.com/group/uk/forum/topics/equalities-and-conscienc...

--

The Left seems confused.  Are babies born to Muslim parents Muslim or are they not?  I am confused as to what they think. 

This is an aspect of the Chasm which I haven't anticipated.  Christine Odone pimps her catholicism regularly in The Telegraph, and indulges in a bit of verbal gay-bashing.  But Putin has made her into a supporter of gay marriage.

http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/cristinaodone/100258886/vladimir-...

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Muslim Terrorism Count

Thousands of Deadly Islamic Terror Attacks Since 9/11

Mission Overview

Most Western societies are based on Secular Democracy, which itself is based on the concept that the open marketplace of ideas leads to the optimum government. Whilst that model has been very successful, it has defects. The 4 Freedoms address 4 of the principal vulnerabilities, and gives corrections to them. 

At the moment, one of the main actors exploiting these defects, is Islam, so this site pays particular attention to that threat.

Islam, operating at the micro and macro levels, is unstoppable by individuals, hence: "It takes a nation to protect the nation". There is not enough time to fight all its attacks, nor to read them nor even to record them. So the members of 4F try to curate a representative subset of these events.

We need to capture this information before it is removed.  The site already contains sufficient information to cover most issues, but our members add further updates when possible.

We hope that free nations will wake up to stop the threat, and force the separation of (Islamic) Church and State. This will also allow moderate Muslims to escape from their totalitarian political system.

The 4 Freedoms

These 4 freedoms are designed to close 4 vulnerabilities in Secular Democracy, by making them SP or Self-Protecting (see Hobbes's first law of nature). But Democracy also requires - in addition to the standard divisions of Executive, Legislature & Judiciary - a fourth body, Protector of the Open Society (POS), to monitor all its vulnerabilities (see also Popper). 
1. SP Freedom of Speech
Any speech is allowed - except that advocating the end of these freedoms
2. SP Freedom of Election
Any party is allowed - except one advocating the end of these freedoms
3. SP Freedom from Voter Importation
Immigration is allowed - except where that changes the political demography (this is electoral fraud)
4. SP Freedom from Debt
The Central Bank is allowed to create debt - except where that debt burden can pass across a generation (25 years).

An additional Freedom from Religion is deducible if the law is applied equally to everyone:

  • Religious and cultural activities are exempt from legal oversight except where they intrude into the public sphere (Res Publica)"

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