The 4 Freedoms Library

It takes a nation to protect the nation

Fightback by Ideology, Dialogue & Constitution


Fightback by Ideology, Dialogue & Constitution

Deals with ideological threats to our freedom and society.  

Analyses argument and rhetoric in all its forms: media interview, debate, and oratory.

Also considers fight back by fixing the 4 constitutional vulnerabilities as identified in the principles of 4F.

Members: 42
Latest Activity: on Sunday

Key Info

Religious arguments go in the Theology Room, so all the rest (i.e. secular ones) come into this room. One-on-one arguments are treated in the same way as combat skills are treated in the UFC, as a pure skill, unrelated to the truth or falsehood (whatever that is) of the underlying message.

The CODA glossary is here:

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  • "The strictly leveled playing field is not a level playing field  (it advantages thugs)" - Alan Lake
  • "Let me now state what seems to me the decisive objection to any conservatism which deserves to be called such. It is that by its very nature it cannot offer an alternative to the direction in which we are moving. It may succeed by its resistance to current tendencies in slowing down undesirable developments, but, since it does not indicate another direction, it cannot prevent their continuance. It has, for this reason, invariably been the fate of conservatism to be dragged along a path not of its own choosing. The tug of war between conservatives and progressives can only affect the speed, not the direction, of contemporary developments." - Hayek, 1961

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Discussion Forum

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Scott Adams: Master Persuader Series

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The Left: their Motivations, and their Islamic Alliance

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Failed Heroes of the Left: Che Guevara

Started by Alan Lake. Last reply by Alan Lake Nov 3, 2017. 10 Replies

Tommy Robinson - Interviews and Dialogue Analysis

Started by Alan Lake. Last reply by Alan Lake Oct 27, 2017. 16 Replies

Failed Heroes of the Left: Billy Bragg

Started by Alan Lake. Last reply by Kinana Oct 26, 2017. 1 Reply

4 Freedoms - Key Frameworks

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Started by Alan Lake. Last reply by Alan Lake Sep 20, 2017. 18 Replies

Comment Wall

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Comment by Alan Lake on February 24, 2018 at 20:14

I don't need to worry about it Joe.  I trust the MSM to dig out little details like this and make the connections for me. The 4th Estate is totally on the side of Truth, Freedom and the common people.

LOL! As if!

Comment by Joe on February 24, 2018 at 19:29

Leaving this here, in case anyone can think of somewhere more suitable.

Remember the kid from the Florida school who was paraded around our TVs, speaking out against gun control (you know, the one who was filming interviews with other teens who were hiding in closets during the incident in the school)?

Here's a page from his Instagram.  What are the odds that a teenager who became a media star during this incident also happened to have a box of M&Ms from AirForce 1 (and signed by the big zero Obama)?

Comment by Alan Lake on February 22, 2018 at 7:02

I haven't read that book. But reading the reviews, I don't think its for me.  I'm tired of all the 'big historical pattern' speakers.  What's the point, when you can simply point to Muslim demographics to prove the end of the West as we know it, in 40 years?

Comment by Philip Smeeton on February 21, 2018 at 22:53

A good conversation is talking about yourself and being asked about yourself, being listened to and agreed with.
They talk in the Jordan Peterson video about the good intelligent conversation, but that has to be a dialogue not a monologue by two people. All of the commenters sounded like messed up liberals lost in a fog of self-admiring thought.
It is naive to believe that the objective of a conversation or dialogue is to come to an agreement or compromise. A good conversation can be polarizing and reinforce opposing positions. We are all in some sort of competition with each other.
How can you seriously discuss masculinity and femininity with someone that identifies as transgender?

Comment by Antony on February 21, 2018 at 17:58

Talking about glitches in matrixes etc - has anyone read this new Niall Fergusson book ? ;

Comment by Philip Smeeton on February 20, 2018 at 16:32

Conservatism Is Cowardice.
I think this discussion is more about honesty than bravery. When a black man says to me that he is British, I say that he is not. But I do not tell the truth and say what I feel if it is going to get me punched in the face. I am English/British, my ancestors have been so for more than a thousand years. The black man or muslim or whatever does not have my history and ancestry. You are the DNA of your parents. If one of your parents is British then you are half-British and so on. Being born in or living in a country does not make you a member of that nation, you belong elsewhere, your ancestry and history are not mine. I am a racist, I want to live in a nation where the vast majority of people are white. I am not very brave but I am honest. I am honest about who I am and my identity and how i want my life and country to be. That is my right. America has a European derived culture, The majority of Americans are European-Americans. This is their heritage and identity. A multi-racial society is a society divided, that will remain so due to self-segregation. Race is the primary identity factor for large national groupings of people.
The Christian values are not exclusively christian values, they are human values. Every society has to have values, laws and codes of behaviour in order to be able to continue to exist. Such as when it is allowed to kill another human being and who owns what. Any nation can have what we term “good” values.
Western Civilization is European and White. We need leaders that will protect the interests of the members of the Nation. A nation has to have leadership; an example that can be relied upon and that is honest, speaks the nation's version of the truth. Define the truth.

Comment by Antony on February 19, 2018 at 15:13
Comment by Antony on February 18, 2018 at 20:56
Comment by Philip Smeeton on February 13, 2018 at 9:26

This speech was also vital.
Speech on Islam in the Swedish Parliament - Richard Jomshof (SD) (ENGSUBS)
A brilliant speech.

Comment by Philip Smeeton on February 13, 2018 at 9:24

Thank you again Joe, and Alan. I have been putting this mohammed video out wherever I can think of and am getting positive responses. Propaganda when true is vital.


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Muslim Terrorism Count

Thousands of Deadly Islamic Terror Attacks Since 9/11

Mission Overview

Most Western societies are based on Secular Democracy, which itself is based on the concept that the open marketplace of ideas leads to the optimum government. Whilst that model has been very successful, it has defects. The 4 Freedoms address 4 of the principal vulnerabilities, and gives corrections to them. 

At the moment, one of the main actors exploiting these defects, is Islam, so this site pays particular attention to that threat.

Islam, operating at the micro and macro levels, is unstoppable by individuals, hence: "It takes a nation to protect the nation". There is not enough time to fight all its attacks, nor to read them nor even to record them. So the members of 4F try to curate a representative subset of these events.

We need to capture this information before it is removed.  The site already contains sufficient information to cover most issues, but our members add further updates when possible.

We hope that free nations will wake up to stop the threat, and force the separation of (Islamic) Church and State. This will also allow moderate Muslims to escape from their totalitarian political system.

The 4 Freedoms

These 4 freedoms are designed to close 4 vulnerabilities in Secular Democracy, by making them SP or Self-Protecting (see Hobbes's first law of nature). But Democracy also requires - in addition to the standard divisions of Executive, Legislature & Judiciary - a fourth body, Protector of the Open Society (POS), to monitor all its vulnerabilities (see also Popper). 
1. SP Freedom of Speech
Any speech is allowed - except that advocating the end of these freedoms
2. SP Freedom of Election
Any party is allowed - except one advocating the end of these freedoms
3. SP Freedom from Voter Importation
Immigration is allowed - except where that changes the political demography (this is electoral fraud)
4. SP Freedom from Debt
The Central Bank is allowed to create debt - except where that debt burden can pass across a generation (25 years).

An additional Freedom from Religion is deducible if the law is applied equally to everyone:

  • Religious and cultural activities are exempt from legal oversight except where they intrude into the public sphere (Res Publica)"

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