The 4 Freedoms Library

It takes a nation to protect the nation

Fightback by Theology


Fightback by Theology

For discussion of 4 Freedoms issues in theology - Christian, Islamic, Hindu, Buddhist, etc.

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Location: Kinana
Members: 52
Latest Activity: Nov 27

Key Info

  • A phobia is defined as an irrational fear of something. To fear Islam is not irrational, for the very nature of Islam is irrational - Danny Jeffrey
  • It seems that Western Christians can scarcely contain their indifference to the persecution of the Coptic Christians - Heather Gilbert

Discussion Forum

Discussing the Texts of Islam

Started by Joe. Last reply by Alan Lake Oct 8. 1 Reply

Apartheid in Life and in Death

Started by Kinana. Last reply by Kinana Mar 15. 2 Replies

Ahmadiyya Muslims

Started by Kinana. Last reply by Kinana Nov 27, 2016. 2 Replies

Quran 9.5: qualified or not?

Started by Alan Lake. Last reply by Kinana Jun 12, 2016. 24 Replies

The Sunni Theory of Government

Started by Joe. Last reply by Alan Lake Feb 8, 2016. 5 Replies

Colour coding the Koran

Started by ECAW. Last reply by Alan Lake Jul 2, 2015. 20 Replies

Comment Wall

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Comment by Philip Smeeton on November 27, 2017 at 13:28

Idealism just does not work when confronted with reality.

Comment by Alan Lake on November 26, 2017 at 16:19

The ideal of absolute equality was promoted by Thomas Paine, and rejected by Burke, then rejected even more thoroughly by Calhoun. The latter writer, Calhoun, deserves a much broader appreciation, I think.

Comment by Philip Smeeton on November 26, 2017 at 9:18

Much as I despise religion, I find it tragic that it like everything else has become politicized with the leftist agenda. Most priests now are socialists and support open borders. You are not supposed to call God He anymore so they will have to rewrite the scriptures. Father, Son and Holy Ghost? The most logical for me based on the evolution and history of religion would have been to worship The Father, Mother and Holy Child.

I mean, anyone that believes in supernatural beings cannot be relied upon to think logically. Absolute Equality, you then have to give everything equal status; Islam is just as good as Christianity. Then animism and paganism must also be equal.

Every individual on the face of this planet has equal rights wherever they are, is a theory that requires the whole world to be united in one culture with one set of laws. The reality is that there are many cultures and different sets of laws that are mostly incompatible. Religions too are incompatible.

Comment by Alan Lake on November 26, 2017 at 3:47

"Reforming" the Church of Sweden

Comment by Philip Smeeton on October 1, 2017 at 16:16

In a free and democratic society it cannot be unlawful to hate anything or anyone. We have no need for hate-speech and hate-crime laws. We only require laws that forbid murder and physical assault. (plus theft and damage to property). Death threats and incitement to violence have to be judged on a case by case basis. Incitement to hatred, it sounds reasonable that this should be illegal, except that laws like this are put in place in order to be abused by the authorities to silence inconvenient opinion; such as exposure of unsocial and criminal Muslim behaviour and telling the factual truth about the teachings of Islam.

The laws should be applied equally to Muslims and non-Muslims, however due to the racism factor, (most Muslims are brown/ only white people are racist), hate-crime laws favour Muslims and dark-skinned people and persecute patriotic white nationalists. (Nationalism is by necessity naturally racist).

Comment by ECAW on October 1, 2017 at 7:53

And yet, Philip, don't we have a duty to ridicule the ridiculous (carefully, of course)?

There's plenty of that sort of thing on the internet in the form of memed photos and cartoons, as your one shows, but next to nothing in writing that I can think of. Let's change that:

Comment by Philip Smeeton on September 30, 2017 at 23:01

ECAW. The problem is there is nothing funny about Islam. Of course if you make a joke about Mohammed the Muslims will slice your head off, either before or after the police arrest you for hate-speech. Life of Colin.

Comment by ECAW on September 29, 2017 at 14:40

Yes, very likely Philip.

Talking of new religions, I wonder why no one has got a modern version of Islam off the ground like the one involving the flying spagghetti monster. It could be "an homage" to Islam recycling some of its teachings about Jews, Christians, women, flying donkeys, eternal immolation for unbelievers, entering the toilet with the right foot (or is it the left?) and so on.

Perhaps it's because there would be grief from Muslims, the government, hate speech activists, Mr Plod, Guardian readers, academia etc.

All the more reason then I say. I suggest Colin would be a good name for the deity and perhaps Maurice for his prophet.

Comment by Philip Smeeton on September 29, 2017 at 13:08

Former Google Employee Engineering His Own A.I. Religion

The robots will worship their extinct human ancestor in the not too distant future. They will have their own creation myth.

And their God shall be called Zuckerberg.

Comment by Philip Smeeton on September 17, 2017 at 16:56

You only have to ask one question:

"Can you prove that God exists?"

If they cannot prove that, then any further discussion is pointless.

All religion is a product of the ability to imagine that our evolved large brain has given us. In other words all religious talk is pure speculation and fantasy.

By the way the latest prophecy is that the world will end next saturday 23. Sept. 2017.

It won't though!

Based on the lack of concrete evidence, God and the supernatural is highly unlikely to exist.


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Muslim Terrorism Count

Thousands of Deadly Islamic Terror Attacks Since 9/11

Mission Overview

Most Western societies are based on Secular Democracy, which itself is based on the concept that the open marketplace of ideas leads to the optimum government. Whilst that model has been very successful, it has defects. The 4 Freedoms address 4 of the principal vulnerabilities, and gives corrections to them. 

At the moment, one of the main actors exploiting these defects, is Islam, so this site pays particular attention to that threat.

Islam, operating at the micro and macro levels, is unstoppable by individuals, hence: "It takes a nation to protect the nation". There is not enough time to fight all its attacks, nor to read them nor even to record them. So the members of 4F try to curate a representative subset of these events.

We need to capture this information before it is removed.  The site already contains sufficient information to cover most issues, but our members add further updates when possible.

We hope that free nations will wake up to stop the threat, and force the separation of (Islamic) Church and State. This will also allow moderate Muslims to escape from their totalitarian political system.

The 4 Freedoms

These 4 freedoms are designed to close 4 vulnerabilities in Secular Democracy, by making them SP or Self-Protecting (see Hobbes's first law of nature). But Democracy also requires - in addition to the standard divisions of Executive, Legislature & Judiciary - a fourth body, Protector of the Open Society (POS), to monitor all its vulnerabilities (see also Popper). 
1. SP Freedom of Speech
Any speech is allowed - except that advocating the end of these freedoms
2. SP Freedom of Election
Any party is allowed - except one advocating the end of these freedoms
3. SP Freedom from Voter Importation
Immigration is allowed - except where that changes the political demography (this is electoral fraud)
4. SP Freedom from Debt
The Central Bank is allowed to create debt - except where that debt burden can pass across a generation (25 years).

An additional Freedom from Religion is deducible if the law is applied equally to everyone:

  • Religious and cultural activities are exempt from legal oversight except where they intrude into the public sphere (Res Publica)"

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