The 4 Freedoms Library

It takes a nation to protect the nation

I'm gobsmacked by this news, how could Tommy and Kev do this to us, many feel that we have been dumped, discarded, served our purpose and not given even a small amount of warning that they were going to do this.

The Bradford demo, people will have booked hotels, trains, buses and now will be out of pocket, our forum, no one knows what will happen to that, all up in the air, so to speak.

There are many questions and no answers.


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I cannot really imagine the pressures they have experienced since the start of the EDL.  I am grateful for their crucial founding role in this movement. 

But to answer your headline question: No it is not the end of the EDL.  Too many people are committed to this movement and cause beyond their relationship with these two fine men.

But there are many questions and I trust the answers will be forthcoming, hopefully directly from Tommy and Kevin instead of via the media.

Can anyone explain what this is about? Have they cancelled the Bradford demo or more than that?

That doesn't really help. I can only guess. Has the EDL cancelled the demo because of the possibility of a massive backlash and/or violence at the demo?.... I've just looked at the EDL website at it thinks it's still going ahead.

... Oh. Now I know.

Thanks Kinana, there is a lot of confusion at the mo and I hope things will became clearer soon.


This is not the end of the EDL - there are plenty of decent people at grassroots level who can come to the fore, yes, you can bet neo-fascist parasites & fraudsters such as NF,BNP, Britain First etc will be trying to make their move in a rule or ruin exercise... but ordinary members can look sharp and see  these moronic losers off.

Yes - there will have to be a re-evaluation of tactics, street demos can only accomplish so much, and if they are held in some remote car park fenced off from the public, I'd suggest they accomplish very little apart from a financial burden on members, so demos may very well become more sporadic, and with other forms of "agit-prop" (to use a left term) will be used more frequently.

IMO this is the end of EDL.  For the leaders to leave, giving as their excuse that it is infiltrated with neo-nazis who they cannot control, means that no-one is going to be able to step into their shoes.  No-one is going to believe that anyone who steps forward to lead EDL will be able to control "the nazi infiltrators".

The proper way to leave would have been to say "I have decided that organisation X. is the way forward for me".  But this is a policy of slash and burn. 

You can be sure that the establishment have been behind this.  Destroy EDL on your way out.

I expect we will see British Breiviks appear.  And muslim organisations will be delighted. Because they will be able to say "see, the terrorism is on both sides".

Sadly, Tommy has joined a muslim organisation.  And not just a muslim organisation, but one that is useless.  I am sure that for the last 3 years he has been under a strain that would have destroyed 99% of people. So, I don't blame him for stepping away from EDL. 

I confirm that the Bradford demo is still on. 

Some how I am not surprised. I had a funny feeling when I saw this photo

Take a second look at the tee shirt

Surely Tommy doesn't believe that 'Mo' Ansar is a moderate Muslim. He is a slimy liar who says different things to different audiences. He is utterly repulsive and utterly Islamist. He is dancing around the media. Or at least he's controlling at least some in the media (the BBC, The Guardian, etc.). Perhaps that explains his constant smug smile... I am prepared to accept the Quilliam Foundation's moderation, but Mo Ansar's?????... Then again, this might have just been an inane photo-shoot for political purposes - on both sides.

Perhaps Tommy is playing the larger game of politics. And sometimes in politics you have to do stuff which many of your supporters won't agree with but which might - it just might! - have positive implications when it comes to fighting Islamism. In politics, that's the way it goes. That's why I couldn't really be a politicians or even completely support a political party. I couldn't keep my mouth shut or toe the party line on everything.


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Muslim Terrorism Count

Thousands of Deadly Islamic Terror Attacks Since 9/11

Mission Overview

Most Western societies are based on Secular Democracy, which itself is based on the concept that the open marketplace of ideas leads to the optimum government. Whilst that model has been very successful, it has defects. The 4 Freedoms address 4 of the principal vulnerabilities, and gives corrections to them. 

At the moment, one of the main actors exploiting these defects, is Islam, so this site pays particular attention to that threat.

Islam, operating at the micro and macro levels, is unstoppable by individuals, hence: "It takes a nation to protect the nation". There is not enough time to fight all its attacks, nor to read them nor even to record them. So the members of 4F try to curate a representative subset of these events.

We need to capture this information before it is removed.  The site already contains sufficient information to cover most issues, but our members add further updates when possible.

We hope that free nations will wake up to stop the threat, and force the separation of (Islamic) Church and State. This will also allow moderate Muslims to escape from their totalitarian political system.

The 4 Freedoms

These 4 freedoms are designed to close 4 vulnerabilities in Secular Democracy, by making them SP or Self-Protecting (see Hobbes's first law of nature). But Democracy also requires - in addition to the standard divisions of Executive, Legislature & Judiciary - a fourth body, Protector of the Open Society (POS), to monitor all its vulnerabilities (see also Popper). 
1. SP Freedom of Speech
Any speech is allowed - except that advocating the end of these freedoms
2. SP Freedom of Election
Any party is allowed - except one advocating the end of these freedoms
3. SP Freedom from Voter Importation
Immigration is allowed - except where that changes the political demography (this is electoral fraud)
4. SP Freedom from Debt
The Central Bank is allowed to create debt - except where that debt burden can pass across a generation (25 years).

An additional Freedom from Religion is deducible if the law is applied equally to everyone:

  • Religious and cultural activities are exempt from legal oversight except where they intrude into the public sphere (Res Publica)"

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