The 4 Freedoms Library

It takes a nation to protect the nation

I know I've mentioned this survey several times, but I don't think we have any discussion of it.

2013 survey - 40% of Britons think civil war with muslims is "inevitable" (up from 33%).

http://www.theguardian.com/uk/2013/may/26/public-attitude-muslims-c...

4 years ago, when I first woke up to the threat being from islam rather than a few nutters, I found very disturbing those people who were envisaging a civil war.  I used to avoid getting into debates with them, because I found the idea so horrendous I didn't even want to contemplate the possibility of it.  And if you had asked me at the start of 2013 what % of the British public thought such a civil war likely, I'd have put the figure at 3%.  Seeing this survey earlier this year, I realised just how far behind the curve my thinking was.  So, I think we should start documenting the steps that are indicative of the coming war. In that Guardian survey, 59% say they think a civil war is "likely" or "inevitable".  That such a shocking survey was tucked away in The Guardian and has never received any kind of wider discussion shows that the public discourse as reflected by the media could hardly be further away from the private discourse happening between individuals.

We should remember that Breivik saw himself as a jihadi.  Jihadis see themselves as exemplary individuals, hoping to show others the way.  So too did Breivik.  I saw several articles published today which made me think that the signs of civil war are becoming clearer.

19yo soldier arrested in Germany for nail bomb found in his home in Salford.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/law-and-order/10493380/Soldi...

100s of "British" jihadis being trained in Syria.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/middleeast/syria/10492997...

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/middleeast/syria/10491523...

And let's not forget the murder of Lee Rigby, the attempt to assassinate Stephen Timms.  I dare say if we look back over the past few years, we will see other markers that we should have noted.

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Replies to This Discussion

Britain will descend into 'vigilantism' unless security measures are stepped up, former MI5 boss warns

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/terrorism-in-the-uk/11343802...

5 years ago, I first discovered 4F.

I ran off after a few weeks, horrified that people were calmly predicting civil war.  After a year or two I became reconciled to this inevitability.

In the last 6 months or so, I've seen commenters at The Telegraph and The Spectator also calmly talking about civil war.

Now the deluded, Polyanna, Panglossian Leftard dullards at Harry's Place are also considering it.

https://disqus.com/home/discussion/harrysplace/charlie_hebdo_reacti...

They are also discussing the idea that the indigenous population of Europe will turn to a fascist party to do their work for them.  I was screaming at these Leftards 3 to 4 years ago, that if they continued in the path in which they were travelling, then this is what be the outcome.

As I keep saying, if I was someone who was motivated by money, we'd be making investments to benefit from being years ahead of others in recognising what is coming.

Some of them are even talking about their friends who have bought land in other countries.  The one who is saying "islam will fail" is talking about moving to Brazil, because he thinks that is the western country that will best survive.  These are all the things we've been saying.

Typical of the deluded, hypocritical Leftists that they believe the same things we do, but don't have the integrity to admit it.

The Left were so hypnotised by multi-culti ideology, they were cheerleading the banking/power elites plans to import cheap labour to undercut the cost of indiginous labour and to "discipline the workforce"... and to spread civil strife by importing immigrants who were hostile to our urge for a democratic way of life.

A "hard right" government may very well restrict immigration (though I'm cynical on even that !), but they will also, at the behest of our oligarchs and neo-aristocrats, restrict free speech and imprison/harass those they deem to be against their sociopathic money grubbing interests such as those who have exposed and spoken out about the various banking scandals and tax scams they operate.

Christopher Caldwell - immigration & islam, Europe's crisis of faith ; http://churchandstate.org.uk/2015/01/immigration-and-islam-europes-...

This is from a recent article in the Jylands Posten.  The whole thing can be summarised by Steyn's "demographics is destiny".  The academic being interviewed is getting his own children out of Europe.

http://4freedoms.com/group/demographics/forum/topics/demographics-i...

This is a reader comment, which Tundra Tabloids decided to put on their front page.

Jaakko Raipala says:
January 29, 2015 at 11:59 pm GMT • 500 Words

Replying to @Whiskey:

[“There will be nothing but say, Pakistan writ large all over Europe. FundamentallyEuropean men lack the will to fight and kill to keep what is theirs from about 1.5 billion Muslims who want it — and most European women will happily go along at least they get domination.]

 It would be hard to come up with sillier nonsense. If history has proven anything at all it has proven that European men certainly do not lack the will to fight and kill. That is why our states keep mainly cracking down on native men, they’re much more afraid of the European man than the Muslim and for a good reason. Unfortunately these things tend to turn into self-fulfilling prophecies and trying to ignore growing problems because you’re scared of the people offering solutions will often just give you a more radical solution in the end.

The root of the conflict is that European ethics restricts fighting and killing to the state monopoly of violence, Islamic ethics does not. If, say, a bunch of Englishmen had attacked Charlie Hebdo for mocking something important to Englishmen (it is a French satirical, after all), it would be expected for the Prime Minister and the Queen to show up on TV to condemn the atrocity and promise action against whichever faction pulled it off. Most Englishmen would be disgusted as Englishmen will never approve of shooting Frenchmen for some English cause outside the context of a European war with European cultural rules of engagement – but then, if such a war were to happen most Englishmen would be perfectly OK with shooting at Frenchmen for the sake of some English cause.

With Islam nothing works like this. No Muslim organization shows up to assume the responsibility for policing extremists. Islamic terrorists hide behind the fact that Islam isn’t organized in a European way of assigning responsibilities. Islam deliberately obfuscates the difference between combatant and civilian. This is all a perfect inverse match for a Europe that’s now phobic about assigning “collective responsibility” to minorities. We are in the uncomfortable situation that we see that a war is being waged and a lot of us would fight in it but the enemy doesn’t act like a European state power.

Our leaders are reluctant to even acknowledge the conflict because they don’t know what to do about it. If no one figures that out in time Western Europe will just fall into a similar situation as much of Eastern Europe with unclear national identities and loyalties and a lot of men who will just choose to fight, damn the consequences. It’s not the end of Europe but it’s the end of nice clear identities that much of Western Europe had finally figured out (only to demonize them because well-being makes people stupid and they start attacking the ideas that made them successful).

American atheist shoots 3 muslims - news sketchy right now - parking lot dispute or politics ?, though I'm not saying that is what happened here, sometimes in society personal/social tensions can trigger broader political upheavals.

https://richarddawkins.net/2015/02/chapel-hill-murders-atheist-hate...

His wife says it was a parking dispute. But since she's just a 2nd class kafir citizen, and a woman as well, all good Dhimmies should ignore what she says, and go with the Muslim narrative.

Over 1/4 of "British" muslims agree with Charlie Hebdo killers ; http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/religion/11434695/Over-a-quarter-of...

I think the actual percentage of muslims agreeing is far higher, I'd take an educated guess that many are just practising taqiya for political expediency.

Paul Austin Murphy.

http://www.americanthinker.com/articles/2015/07/hope_not_hate_and_t...

Interestingly, HNH bringing this idea into the public domain (and it being echoed in newspapers) is more likely to bring about a civil war sooner.  Live imitates art, and the concept being discussed makes it more conceivable earlier to more people.  HNH have probably done more to bring this about sooner than if they had ignored the idea of Mohammed cartoons.  That these leftwing fascists are unfamiliar with the aesthetics of Oscar Wilde is hardly surprising.

Interestingly, just as AMW & TR are being hauled over the coals by HNH, The Telegraph and Tory politicians were also contemplating the prospect of civil war in Europe (of course, they can contemplate this over the rise of [Leftwing] nationalist movements, but not over the rise of islam).

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/economics/11768134/European-alli...

Joe - thanks for the above article - the European civil war smacks of the elite/bankers etc playing one side off against the other so they can hang on to power & wealth. The "left" have valid points against the banking malpractise that led to the slump, tax evasion,money laundering,"drug war", land reform in Scotland etc, whilst the "right" have equally valid concerns about mass immigration,islamification, the closing down of public debate via pc etc.

The left have screwed their support by cheerleading mass immigration and supporting silly post modernist policies such as the ban on hunting with dogs etc. The far right have screwed their support by gratuitous and offensive racism, anti gay/lesbian politics and general backwardness.

Nicely put Antony.  Altho I think a lot of the alleged racism on the right is a media created fable, the rest is accurate.

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Most Western societies are based on Secular Democracy, which itself is based on the concept that the open marketplace of ideas leads to the optimum government. Whilst that model has been very successful, it has defects. The 4 Freedoms address 4 of the principal vulnerabilities, and gives corrections to them. 

At the moment, one of the main actors exploiting these defects, is Islam, so this site pays particular attention to that threat.

Islam, operating at the micro and macro levels, is unstoppable by individuals, hence: "It takes a nation to protect the nation". There is not enough time to fight all its attacks, nor to read them nor even to record them. So the members of 4F try to curate a representative subset of these events.

We need to capture this information before it is removed.  The site already contains sufficient information to cover most issues, but our members add further updates when possible.

We hope that free nations will wake up to stop the threat, and force the separation of (Islamic) Church and State. This will also allow moderate Muslims to escape from their totalitarian political system.

The 4 Freedoms

These 4 freedoms are designed to close 4 vulnerabilities in Secular Democracy, by making them SP or Self-Protecting (see Hobbes's first law of nature). But Democracy also requires - in addition to the standard divisions of Executive, Legislature & Judiciary - a fourth body, Protector of the Open Society (POS), to monitor all its vulnerabilities (see also Popper). 
1. SP Freedom of Speech
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An additional Freedom from Religion is deducible if the law is applied equally to everyone:

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