This is taken from a discussion on Pastorius's blog, that I thought we could benefit from over here. Pastorius made a suggestion about offering Muslim women in the ME, escape from oppression by giving them safety and an education over in the west, on condition they don't bring any men or children with them. Erum (obviously a Muslim) responded with this:
Erum said... You'll be lucky if you find 5 let alone 500. But do try. Meanwhile, you didn't quite answer the question - what are you going to do about the hundreds that you lose every year to Islam - your own women crossing to the other side of their own free will (more white than black) - no tempting offers, no $$$, no 'immodest proposals' like yours - Losing more numbers than you are gaining - What kind of a victory is that? Doesn't it make you ask - what do they not find in their own (infidel) men??
To which I made the following comment.
I think this comment deserves a bit more chewing.
* lets ignore the final schoolboy jibe about 'what they don't find in their own men'
* lets take on board the previous reminder that some women chase after mass murderers and even child molesters in prison, so some women just have loopy taste
* lets dismiss that initial taunt that "you'll be lucky if you find 5" since none of us have any data and I have seen many disaffected women who are looking for any way out
That gets rid of the junk, so now maybe we can extract some value from this question. Refer to Diana West's "Death of the Grown Up" and Fjordmann's comments on rape of Swedish women in Malmo while the Swedish men stand pacifistically by.
If there is a problem, it is not that Western men are somehow less manly in an intrinsic sense than Muslim men. Remember Saddams gulf army anyone? Not very manly there were you?
But we do have a problem with our adulthood and our freedom to behave as men in the classical sense, and that's two problems that men in Muslim societies don't have to deal with. There's nothing wrong with Western men, but we have been neutered to some extent by the creeping forces of misguided liberalism and a somewhat perverted form of feminism. For that reason, there is a sense, I believe, that some women can experience a kind of relief in crossing over to the Muslim fold. Of course that relief could be short lived when they find out all they other rights they've lost, but its a bit academic by then anyway. But what this shows is that we have lost something in our mad rush to modernise and liberalise our society and free ourselves from all 'irrational' historical and tribal/ethnic traces, and some people are feeling that loss and reacting to it.
This is too big a topic to cover in a post like this, so I'll just wrap up with two suggestions.
(1) We need to get back to older style 'adult' leaders that don't wince so much when faced with tough actions for tough problems (like keeping Gitmo or tackling Irans nuclear plans). We need ones that have had more experience of the dirty side of survival.
(2) We need to re-appraise the role of women in society, and consider for example, that if you emasculate the society so much that women no longer receive protection from rape, is it worth it?